Dec 15th 2009 09:08 am They’ll be odd jobs
I have for years been a general critic of economic trends within the United States. I will be the first to avow I’m no good with money, but some things have always seemed self-evident to me: Isn’t it a bad idea to send so many of our jobs to other countries? Isn’t it a bad idea to base our economy on selling cheap junk paid for with credit cards? Then, what do I know? Things held together reasonably well for so long that I had come to doubt my doubts. However, I think maybe I was on to something all along.
Posted by jimmyjohnson / Vintage A&J
Chris on 15 Dec 2009 at 9:20 am #
Hmmm, let’s see here… the economy tanked because it was held up based on shady loans and sketchy bundling of high-risk options together with what we now call “toxic assets” all based on the concept of buying more than one can afford in the hopes of selling it for even more to someone else who also can’t afford it who will then sell it for even more for someone else who can’t afford it and so on and so on and so on. There was not much basing it on actual production, but rather speculation. So I’ll go out on a limb and say you were on to something all along.
T on 15 Dec 2009 at 9:22 am #
Agree 100 percent!!!!!
Matthew on 15 Dec 2009 at 9:31 am #
“Bad idea” is relative, Mr. Johnson. sometime in the last twenty years, American business stopped working for the workers, for the citizens, or for society, and began working solely for the stockholders. For the stockholders, both shipping jobs overseas AND persuading people into massive debt for plastic junk are good ideas.
Rob Steele on 15 Dec 2009 at 9:39 am #
Is it a bad idea to send jobs away? No. Is it a bad idea to base our economy on debt? Yes. What do you know? Lots, I’m sure.
If you want a good introduction to economics, check out Thomas Sowell’s _Basic Economics_. Dave Ramsey’s _Total Money Makeover_ is good for personal finance.
What will we actually do in a high tech, knowledge based economy? Sit around staring at glowing rectangles and wiggling our fingers, just like I’m doing right now.
Cheers!
Rich (NE IL) on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:09 am #
That’s what I believe is one of our major problems in this country now. We don’t MAKE anything anymore. Everything is “Made in China” or some other far-off place.
I read an article in Crain’s Chicago Business this past summer about the top 50 up-and-coming businesses in Chicago. Guess what? 48 of them produced NOTHING!
So Joe Six-Pack loses his manufacturing job because some bean-counter figures it’s more profitable to off-shore production. After months of searching, he gets a job at Wal-Mart selling the stuff from China that we used to make here. And at a fraction of his former pay.
At this rate, it won’t be long before we are owned by foreign countries. (Some would say that we already are.)
Symply Fargone on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:11 am #
Funny since the Telecom bust in 2001 I haven’t had a job. Not that I am complaining mind you, but many of my friends who rode the wave up and back down are not as fortunate as me. If all we have in this country(eventually) is a bunch of chiefs and no Indians we are headed for a disaster IMHO. Hoping that we get some folks who care about our country more than their bottom line get into office soon. Of course that all depends on who we vote in doesn’t it? I believe the folks around here(in A& J land) are those who care, I am not as worried about us as those who do not take an interest in how we got to where we are and have no clue or inclination on how to change things for the better(regardless of your party leanings). Enough preaching for this old biker hippie, I am Symply Fargone.
Mindy on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:16 am #
What was that poem from high school about the beast slinking or skulking or something, where the center would not hold? Whoa! I’m teetering on the verge of being philosophical!
John in Richmond Texas on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:33 am #
Energy independence (to me, anyway) is the number one thing we need. Of course, I work for an energy related company in Houston and see how much of the items we supply go overseas.
Yes, it is very sad to see America lose all shoe, clothing, furniture, etc. manufacturing to overseas; I hate it; we are losing the character of America; but if a global catastrophe occurred we could probably recreate those industries quicker than replacing energy supplies.
It can be a conundrum; most of us are stockholders through our mutual funds and 401K’s.
To Thomas Sowell, I would add Walter Williams; and Dave Ramsey is right about Staying Out of Debt !! ….. Should we buy gold?
Decades ago, I had a boss say how we’re going to become a service economy and when’s the last time you had good service?
Joe Statuti on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:36 am #
Today’s comments required a reply. History repeats itself and those who don’t learn from history are condemned to repeat it. What is happening to the USA financially is exactly what happened to Spain after the discovery of America and all its gold. Spain hired out all its jobs and grew weak. There are other areas where we are on the verge of repeating history as well. As always, yours is the strip I scope first when checking my comics. Keep ‘em coming.
Connie on 15 Dec 2009 at 11:47 am #
Amen Jimmy! Amen!
I have been feeling, and saying, the same thing for several decades.
Cris in NC on 15 Dec 2009 at 11:56 am #
To Rob Steele
You said “Is it a bad idea to send jobs away? No.”
Could you explain to me how it’s NOT a bad thing to send thousands upon thousands of textile jobs (my particular industry) overseas - where the goods can be made cheaper, I agree, but also are of cheaper quality? How is not a bad thing for the economy for SO many people to be out of work - not to mention for the people themselves?
Unemployment is at 10% - partly due to the economy, I guess, but speaking for my industry, mostly from our jobs being shipped overseas. My county was built on textiles. Before NAFTA was approved, we had about 2 dozen textile plants employing about 9,000 people - now there’s one left in the county (employing 103 people).
I really hope you can explain it to me because I just don’t understand. From where I sit, it’s a real bad idea to send our jobs overseas.
This isn’t to discount all the other jobs in other industries that have been lost to companies moving overseas - only to clarify my own understanding of how it could possibly NOT be a bad idea to send our jobs away.
fett101 on 15 Dec 2009 at 12:03 pm #
Mindy, do you mean ‘The Second Coming’ by Yeats?
“Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;”
http://www.potw.org/archive/potw351.html
Pete B. on 15 Dec 2009 at 12:09 pm #
Actually, even the stockholders don’t count anymore - it’s all about quarterly bonuses for the executives. Short-term greed trumps everything, and patriotism has no place in today’s business world (ditto for concern about workers or the sustainability of business plans, and in too many cases even basic common sense).
Incompetent executives that have no clue what the rank & file workers they employ (whether those workers live in the U.S. or India or China, etc.) actually do end up spending their days creating and presenting PowerPoint slides full of gibberish like “Maximizing the Leveraging of Synergies” and giving each other bonuses regardless of company performance (Wrecked the global economy? Great job! Here’s a huge sack of money…). I work for a bankrupt telecom equipment company that has been selling its pieces off one by one all year long, and our top executives gave themselves $7.5 million in bonuses just for their third quarter performance alone! Not too shabby for driving a 114 year old tech giant into the ground…
Under circumstances like that, where executives keep increasing their compensation whether their decisions generate profits or bankruptcy (don’t worry - the taxpayers will bail us out if we fail, the dumb saps), is it any wonder that clueless incompetents at the top come to believe that they deserve millions in bonus money just for laying off the people who actually create the good and services the company sells, bonuses that of course require laying off lots of people to free up those millions…
Reminds me of a roommate I had in college: once when we asked him for his share of the rent he said “I pay my rent this month, if I do I won’t have enough money left over to go skiiing this weekend!” It’s all a matter of priorities - if the priorities of our business leaders remain selfish and short-term (and given how well that strategy has been paying them so far this century, why change!), then our country is doomed in the not-so-long run…
sandcastler on 15 Dec 2009 at 12:26 pm #
Thank you all for your fine comments. A small group of us have coffee every morning and have the exact same conversations. Makes me wonder were all of the leaders meet to acquire their contrarian economic views.
Jim in SE Mississippi on 15 Dec 2009 at 2:57 pm #
Chickens, as they are wont to do, come home to roost. What’s frightening to me is how many of them are out there that haven’t arrived home yet.
When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging!
Blinky The Wonder Wombat on 15 Dec 2009 at 2:58 pm #
Before we start complaining about jobs going over sees and the lose of the American manufcturing base, take a minute and look in the mirror. Do you buy all your goods at the locally-owned store or do you shop at the Mega-Lo-mart because the prices are lower? Do you buy locally-grown crops or do you have to have all types of produce throughout the year? Do you drive a car or truck manufactured by an American-based company? Do you own the latest and greatest phones, music players, computers, and games? Is so, you are a benficiary of free trade.
So companies export jobs to increase profits. Do you own stock? Do you make your investment decisions soley on your best return on your investment? Are you counting on a steady growth of your pension plan? Then you are also benefitting from the exporting of jobs.
Unless the United States radically changes its attitudes and decides to throw up trade barriers then, as Bruce Springsteen sang, “those jobs are gone boys and they ain’t comin’ back.”
All does not have to be gloom and doom, though. America is still the technological leader and other countries desire what we offer. Truly free trade will open more markets for what we do best- innovate. Sure change is scary and the transition hurts, but America’s strength is in its ability to adapt and change.
(On a semi-related noted, China with its growing consumer class, is now losing manufacturing jobs to Malaysia and Indonesia).
Steve from Royal Oak, MI on 15 Dec 2009 at 4:44 pm #
Arlo Day for President 2012! Can Jimmy Johnson be his running mate? One of them might have to move.
John in LA late of PNS on 15 Dec 2009 at 6:05 pm #
I wonder who sent those American jobs overseas. GASP, golly, gee-whiz. Could it possibly be the CAPITALISTS? If not the capitalists, who MIGHT it have been? Does this mean that Capitalism is not a particularly good model for Amerikkka? Free Enterprise a better system perhaps?
“sometime in the last twenty years, American business stopped working for the workers, for the citizens, or for society, and began working solely for the stockholders.”
Business has always worked for the stockholder. Even if the only stockholder was only the owner of the business. I mean why have a business if is not to make money? “Some” owners of course much more communitarian w/ a social conscious than others and their bottom line includes the workers–often hard to find. Business is not now, nor has it ever been a philanthropic enterprise. Again some owners, e.g. Bill Gates, are philanthropists but they must become wealthy first.
“when’s the last time you had good service?” To that I say today, yesterday, last week, last month; happens all the time in fact. I am only barely into the lower-middle class income/wealth bracket but I must say, I find the “lowly service” people give me superior service about 99.9% of the time. Hummm, maybe they’re not so ‘lowly’ after all.
Thanks for all you do service folks. I appreciate your efforts.
John in LA late of PNS on 15 Dec 2009 at 6:08 pm #
Pete B. Re-read your post. You NAILED it buddy. Thanks.
Just Jay on 15 Dec 2009 at 9:52 pm #
# region Rant
If you are going to point fingers at who is responsible for out sourcing, off shoring, and the general decline of manufacturing in the U.S., the only place you can really do that is standing in front of a mirror. Think about it. A small town downtown doesn’t die because W** M*** opens nearby, the downtown dies because most of the small town citizens decide that saving a few bucks buying cheap imported junk is more important than supporting local merchants. If we as purchasers started creating demand for U.S. produced goods even though we will pay higher prices for them, the suits would bring the jobs back in a heartbeat. But no, we are a me-first society. Politicians are so afraid of a greedy two bit leech who writes feel good tax cutting initiatives that promise pain free reductions in revenue, that they would rather eliminate health care for 40,000 of the poorest, weakest, and most vulnerable in our state than propose a tax increase. The power of the purse is real, and we can use that power to reward and support Big and Noxious, or we can use that power to reward and support the small local bookstore. But if we don’t start supporting the small local businesses soon, only the WM’s and Big and Noxious’s will be left. And when that happens only books that are guaranteed not to offend the lowest common demoninator in society will be available. Now that’s scary.
# endregion
Thanks for listening.
Jay
John in LA late of PNS on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:25 pm #
And listen I did Jay, Thanks!
Nancy in Bucks County on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:39 pm #
We manufacture furniture in Pennsylvania. Our delightful little company is almost kaput. We just cannot compete with all the offshore product. Nearly all of our Major dealers have decided to just close up rather than fight. We are trying to re-invent ourselves with custom cabinetry, but this economy is just killing us. We have lots of pending orders, but very few actually follow through. They just keep saying, “Maybe in the spring… Maybe in the fall…” Meanwhile, we had to lay off two incredible cabinetmakers… just in time for the holidays. Aaarrrggghhh!!!!!
Laetitia in Australia on 15 Dec 2009 at 10:57 pm #
Pete B. - unlike company exec’s, you can evict the room-mate.
Nancy in Bucks County - I live in a town just like that - commitment phobic about anything, even if they don’t have to pay. The worst part is that I discovered myself starting the same behaviour after 3 years of living here. But I’ll get a reality check (I assume) - I’m moving back to the outskirts of my home-town next week (we’ve just signed the rental lease).
TruckerRon on 16 Dec 2009 at 12:52 am #
The problems of our economy come from several groups who have a common deficit: honor.
It isn’t honorable to write bad laws that favor certain groups in order to get reelected. It isn’t honorable to make a company more profitable on paper by either outsourcing or using temps to manipulate the Revenue Per Employee (if only 10% of your workforce are actual employees, you look REALLY good on paper). It also isn’t honorable to bankrupt an entire country by declaring certain industries “too big to fail” and trying to bail them out with money you don’t have.
Honorable people don’t borrow themselves into massive debt, blame other people for their failings, or pay themselves huge, unearned bonuses.
BTW, some of us seem to have forgotten that most stockholders are those of us with 401Ks or other retirement plans!
Mark in Boston on 16 Dec 2009 at 12:55 am #
Oddly enough there are a lot of jobs we just don’t need anymore. A hundred years ago many families had a maid or “hired girl” at least part-time; now do you know any family that has one? You have a washing machine instead. Remember telephone operators? Remember the guy at the gas station who would pump gas for you? Newspaper typesetters? Keypunch operators? Film developing technicians? Washroom attendants?
None of those jobs were sent overseas. They’re just gone.
And whatever job it is you do for a living, you’re probably 10 times as productive now as you were 30 years ago. You’re doing the work of 10 people and the other 9 are unemployed.
Even in comics — Al Capp always had several assistants. How many do today’s cartoonists have?
Connie on 16 Dec 2009 at 6:10 am #
Steve from Royal Oak, MI said
“Arlo Day for President 2012! Can Jimmy Johnson be his running mate? One of them might have to move.”
The only way you’d get Arlo or Jimmy to even consider something like that Steve is if you moved DC down to the Gulf Coast region, and outsourced the job so they could both go sailing.
Personally, I’d rather Jimmy kept bringing some laughter to the world by creating his comic every day. I’m sure even the president needs to laugh right now. I know I sure need to!
There actually is a reason to open up manufacturing in other countries, but that isn’t what has been happening for the past 30 years. The purpose (and I learned this from an economics class back in the 90s) is to open up another market for your product. However, you can’t tell me that hiring 14 year old girls to work 16 hours a day, 7 days a week for pennies on the dollar has opened up a market for tennis shoes that cost more than they make in a month.
Not only haven’t these companies been creating new markets for their products, they have been destroying the sure market they had, us. How are we supposed to afford their $100 + tennies, when we can’t even afford our mortgages? So not only did they not open up new markets, but they have destroyed the one thriving market they did have.
I could go on but then my politics would be showing and I don’t think that is the purpose of this blog. I just wanted to explain what actual purpose could have been had by paying decent and fair wages to the people in other countries might have given US corporations had they been playing the economics game correctly. They, and the rest of us, would have been more prosperous and happy. Instead, they have cut their own throats by cutting everyone else’s.
Love of money is the root of all evil. Not money, but the LOVE (aka greed) of money.
debbie on 16 Dec 2009 at 6:10 am #
Do what’s right and you cannot go wrong.
Leary on 16 Dec 2009 at 7:30 am #
I agree… and I disagree… but mostly I am not having fun here. …and I thought sports talk was boring… Like Arlo said “But, what will we do?” Ah, I found the exit.
Rob Steele on 16 Dec 2009 at 8:41 am #
Cris in NC, I’m so sorry about your troubles. I grew up in Statesville and Charlotte and love that part of the country. Nevertheless I think the country and the world are better off with our textiles coming from whatever part of the world can produce them most efficiently. The concept is called comparative advantage and says that well being and wealth are maximized when trading partners focus on what they can do most efficiently. That’s not an explanation but it will help you find the right chapter of an economics book if you want to pursue it. God bless!
John in LA late of PNS on 16 Dec 2009 at 2:26 pm #
Mark in Boston on 16 Dec 2009 at 12:55 am #
“Oddly enough there are a lot of jobs we just don’t need anymore. A hundred years ago many families had a maid or “hired girl” at least part-time; now do you know any family that has one?” You have a washing machine instead. Yeah, and she was paid $1 per day plus ‘car fare’ and for a transfer. Maybe a whole $1.5O for ironing, house keeping and watching the kids, doing the washing and hanging it out and folding. 1950s in Birmingham.
“Remember telephone operators?” And they hooked and unhooked cables and talked to other operators to get your call through. WTF would they do today?
“Remember the guy at the gas station who would pump gas for you?” Actually, today I’d go nuts waiting around for the guy.
“Newspaper typesetters? Keypunch operators? Film developing technicians? Washroom attendants?” NOT NEEDED. Just like the Milk Man, Egg Man, Vegetable Man, Fuller Brush Man, Paper Boy, Dry Cleaning Man, getting shaves at the barber, bath house attendant, delivery guys on bikes w/ the tubes of blue prints, riding like hell hither and yon, et al. All gone. Replaced or not needed.
None of those jobs were sent overseas. They’re just gone.
“And whatever job it is you do for a living, you’re probably 10 times as productive now as you were 30 years ago. You’re doing the work of 10 people and the other 9 are unemployed.” So I sat around for 20 years doing nothing and also making Mucho-moola?
“Even in comics — Al Capp always had several assistants. How many do today’s cartoonists have?” And more than a few wonderful cartoonists had none. Again, how many do you need.
Mark in Boston on 16 Dec 2009 at 2:52 pm #
J in LA l o PNS:
You make my point. $1.50 wasn’t much for the hired girl in the 1950’s but she’s out of work now and makes nothing. All those workers did things that are not needed now. As time passes we get more workers and we have fewer jobs for them to do.
I don’t know what your job has been for 20 years, but has your productivity been the same all along? I think not. But let’s look at some examples:
I’m guessing at the numbers, but let’s say In 1950 it took let’s say 4 people to run a single-screen movie theatre. Now a crew of 12 runs a 15-screen multiplex. Five-fold increase in productivity per person.
One of those gigantic cargo ships that brings containers of goods from China to California needs a crew of something like 11 people. This replaces how many smaller ships with how many sailors per?
There are many additional examples of what I would call “forced efficiencies” where policy demands more product of lower quality, for example allocating fewer doctors among more patients. That makes jobs dissappear too.
Ed on 17 Dec 2009 at 1:37 pm #
Amen … guess it’s too obvious!!!
Jacob on 18 Dec 2009 at 11:29 am #
Of course it’s not a good idea to send American jobs overseas, but it’s part of the globalization that technology has made possible. American businesses save major $$ by having certain jobs done overseas for 1/4 the price, and they must do so in order to stay competitive. If they don’t, they’ll price themselves out of the market and their businesses will go under. As this happens, the American standard of living will decline, while the standard of living in regions where this cheap labor is migrating to will increase. As the overseas standards of living increase, so will their demand for higher wages. Eventually we will meet in the middle and the standard of living for all will be somewhere between what we Americans are accustomed to and what the emerging market regions are accustomed to. So as Americans, we can expect our standard of living to drop in the next 10-20 years, until there’s global equalization.